Yes! They can last for years in your body. I found them in my aunt who had a 47 y/o son and she had a very traumatic birth with him. I find trauma does impact the body more with keeping the patterns held in place. But you can release them at any time. Processing the birth and the trauma is very helpful.
How are you able to identify ‘hardness’ in only one aspect of the sacrum. Do you have evidence for these birthing patterns and movement/splaying of the joints
Katy, if you start to palpate the different parts of the sacrum by applying pressures, in supine it would be anteriorly toward the ceiling, in prone towards the floor on one side then the other when you notice a difference in the two sides you may appreciate one side feels harder than the other. You can also do so at the different sacral segments S1, S2, S3, S4 and compare. There are articles showing the widening of the pelvis for labor through MRI studies but I couldn’t find any showing the long-term positions of the ischial tuberosities after birth. I outlined all the research in my presentation at CMS for the APTA in 2020. Thanks for your questions.
So in essence you are saying that if a women has splayed ishiums this would cause compression of the Sacroiliac Joint and potentially appear as low back pain?
It’s possible. There usually is an imbalance between the PSIS at the SIJ and the ischium. Also making sure the sacrum is back in place helps that low back pain as well. So closing the open birthing pattern really helps with low back pain.
In an xray you can see separation of the the pubic symphysis joint but I’m not sure we could identify the ischiums being more splayed apart than normal. Plus identifying it with immobility is the biggest factor. Xrays are 2 dimensional. MRI’s might be better but I’m not sure anyone would be looking for it. We need to find a way to measure this so we can do research on it and get it validated.
Are these patterns seen only in mothers who have had a vaginal birth or in whom labor had started. ? would these be there in case of planned C-section.
Yes labor needs to happen and baby has to enter into the pelvic space for changes to the pelvis to be made. If its a planned C-Section then no effect will have occurred with the pelvis. But if labor starts and baby enters into pelvis and then has c-section you need to look for these patterns.
I would like to add an observation here… It is not always necessary to have had a vaginal birth to have long lasting impact on the pelvic bones. There are instances where the mother has had an emergency cesarian after suffering extreme pressure on the bones… the cesarian can be due to lack of progress and/or pressure that can result in foetal heart rate deceleration., and eventually cesarian.
I’m having trouble here. If the coccyx is off to the right, I would think that the muscle tension would be more on the left, because I am thinking that the displaced coccyx would be pulling on the left side muscles that are stretched tight by the displaced coccyx muscles… what am I not understanding here?
Kathleen, I have just found that the tightness is usually on the side the coccyx is as it’s holding it in that position. Sure the other side might be lengthened and might also have tension. The important piece here is to treat what you find! Sometimes it makes sense and sometimes it doesn’t. This is why we need to get out of our head and into our hands and discover what’s really going on. Thanks for your question.
Thank you Lyne… you’re absolutely right about treating what we find. So true that when doing this while not with a client, I tend to be more cerebral. Thank you for the reminder.
Your answer has made me try and think this a little further… This is what I think years after considering my experience as a doula and a fasciatherapist with 12years of experience now… if this is just a case of gradual pressure that has lengthened the muscle on one side, we would not necessarily be in a situation where trauma is implied. Trauma causes the fascia to retract, spasm and freeze… in this case, the stressed tissues would be on the same side as the coccyx and would not know how to release without help. IN the other case, it would be more a muscular reaction and the tightness would not be of the same order, what we would feel would be tight stretched muscle on the opposite side of the sacrum. What would be your opinion on this?
I agree with your assumption here but my reply is, does it really matter? If you are listening to the tissues, following them where they guide you, whether they are lengthened or being held from trauma the melting usually happens and release follows. Now if the release doesn’t happen and the tissues remain held then I would dive in deeper to see what is holding it there and address the trauma response. When you connect into the tissues you are offering it help with your awareness and bringing clients awareness to it. I guess I don’t get too caught up in what the muscles are actually doing, lengthened vs. retracted as I’m so focused in on what they want to do to release. I like to stay out of my head and in my hands when treating.
can you see these patterns even years after delivery?
Yes! They can last for years in your body. I found them in my aunt who had a 47 y/o son and she had a very traumatic birth with him. I find trauma does impact the body more with keeping the patterns held in place. But you can release them at any time. Processing the birth and the trauma is very helpful.
How are you able to identify ‘hardness’ in only one aspect of the sacrum. Do you have evidence for these birthing patterns and movement/splaying of the joints
Katy, if you start to palpate the different parts of the sacrum by applying pressures, in supine it would be anteriorly toward the ceiling, in prone towards the floor on one side then the other when you notice a difference in the two sides you may appreciate one side feels harder than the other. You can also do so at the different sacral segments S1, S2, S3, S4 and compare. There are articles showing the widening of the pelvis for labor through MRI studies but I couldn’t find any showing the long-term positions of the ischial tuberosities after birth. I outlined all the research in my presentation at CMS for the APTA in 2020. Thanks for your questions.
So in essence you are saying that if a women has splayed ishiums this would cause compression of the Sacroiliac Joint and potentially appear as low back pain?
It’s possible. There usually is an imbalance between the PSIS at the SIJ and the ischium. Also making sure the sacrum is back in place helps that low back pain as well. So closing the open birthing pattern really helps with low back pain.
Yes, that is one way it can cause pain.
Would an X-ray be helpful to see these paterns?
In an xray you can see separation of the the pubic symphysis joint but I’m not sure we could identify the ischiums being more splayed apart than normal. Plus identifying it with immobility is the biggest factor. Xrays are 2 dimensional. MRI’s might be better but I’m not sure anyone would be looking for it. We need to find a way to measure this so we can do research on it and get it validated.
Are these patterns seen only in mothers who have had a vaginal birth or in whom labor had started. ? would these be there in case of planned C-section.
Yes labor needs to happen and baby has to enter into the pelvic space for changes to the pelvis to be made. If its a planned C-Section then no effect will have occurred with the pelvis. But if labor starts and baby enters into pelvis and then has c-section you need to look for these patterns.
I would like to add an observation here… It is not always necessary to have had a vaginal birth to have long lasting impact on the pelvic bones. There are instances where the mother has had an emergency cesarian after suffering extreme pressure on the bones… the cesarian can be due to lack of progress and/or pressure that can result in foetal heart rate deceleration., and eventually cesarian.
Absolutely and I talk about this in another unit too. Thanks for commenting!
I’m having trouble here. If the coccyx is off to the right, I would think that the muscle tension would be more on the left, because I am thinking that the displaced coccyx would be pulling on the left side muscles that are stretched tight by the displaced coccyx muscles… what am I not understanding here?
Kathleen, I have just found that the tightness is usually on the side the coccyx is as it’s holding it in that position. Sure the other side might be lengthened and might also have tension. The important piece here is to treat what you find! Sometimes it makes sense and sometimes it doesn’t. This is why we need to get out of our head and into our hands and discover what’s really going on. Thanks for your question.
Thank you Lyne… you’re absolutely right about treating what we find. So true that when doing this while not with a client, I tend to be more cerebral. Thank you for the reminder.
Your answer has made me try and think this a little further… This is what I think years after considering my experience as a doula and a fasciatherapist with 12years of experience now… if this is just a case of gradual pressure that has lengthened the muscle on one side, we would not necessarily be in a situation where trauma is implied. Trauma causes the fascia to retract, spasm and freeze… in this case, the stressed tissues would be on the same side as the coccyx and would not know how to release without help. IN the other case, it would be more a muscular reaction and the tightness would not be of the same order, what we would feel would be tight stretched muscle on the opposite side of the sacrum. What would be your opinion on this?
I agree with your assumption here but my reply is, does it really matter? If you are listening to the tissues, following them where they guide you, whether they are lengthened or being held from trauma the melting usually happens and release follows. Now if the release doesn’t happen and the tissues remain held then I would dive in deeper to see what is holding it there and address the trauma response. When you connect into the tissues you are offering it help with your awareness and bringing clients awareness to it. I guess I don’t get too caught up in what the muscles are actually doing, lengthened vs. retracted as I’m so focused in on what they want to do to release. I like to stay out of my head and in my hands when treating.